‘There were tantrums. There were innuendos!’ Tom Daley talks all things The Game of Wool

The Game of Wool is bringing the world of knitting and crochet to prime-time TV, and we couldn’t be more excited. Hosted by Tom Daley, with expert judges Di Gilpin and Sheila Greenwell, the new Channel 4 series celebrates creativity, skill and the joy of making.

We caught up with all three to hear about their thoughts, what to expect from the show and why knitting and crochet are for everyone!

I wanted to ask about the premise of the show. What are you hoping people will gain from this?

Di Gilpin: Well, we really, really, really hope people are going to be so tuned in and turned on to knitting and crochet that it's going to start a whole generational thing.

Lots of new knitters and within families, you know, grannies, mums, children, all joining in, dads, everybody having a go, so that they can sit on the sofa and follow the journey.

Sheila Greenwell: Yeah, you know, there's lots of drama in this. Might not be a word that you associate with knitting. I think they're gonna be hooked.

Tom Daley: I think one thing that people will be surprised about with the show is that, well, inspired by the creativity of what is possible to create with two knitting needles and a crochet hook.

It’s kind of pushing the limits of creativity, testing the limits of like knitting engineering and being able to construct things that have to like fit or be fit for purpose.

It's been a huge passion of mine to get as many people involved in knitting as possible, because the mindfulness aspect of it, the fact that you have to be present and you have to stay in the moment, is incredibly important.

What is the format of the show, and does it differ from other competition shows?

Tom Daley: For these 10 contestants, it's not the relaxing knitting journey that they're probably used to. It's a very intense competition. It starts with a group knit, which is a surprise challenge for all of the knitters and crocheters; they will only find out, as I actually say, the challenge for the very first time. Then they work as a group.

Then it's ranked by Diane and Sheila. After that ranking takes place, we then go into the solo challenge, which is really between the two of them. Then they get to decide who they want to cast off from the show. For any knitters, cast off is obviously a knitting reference of how you take your knitting off your needles!

Di Gilpin: Lots of drama, lots of tension, believe it or not, lots of fun.

Sheila Greenwell: The idea of the group challenge. You know, that doesn't happen in other shows, but we really wanted that element of it, because they work together, they help each other, they support each other.

Di and I, that's a blind challenge, so we don't see them at all during that, which adds a bit to the drama as well. Don't you think?

Tom Daley: Yeah, absolutely. It also allows them to create something slightly larger than what they might be able to finish on their own as well.

Did the drama take you by surprise, or as kind of seasoned pros, were you expected to find that?

Sheila Greenwell: We are used to working to deadlines, but not deadlines like these people have to work too.

Tom Daley:  Some of the challenges are 10 hours. Some of the challenges are 12 hours. And although that seems like a long time to knit something, it is a very small amount of time to knit, let's say, a jumper, a cardigan, a sofa…

Anything you can imagine that can be knitted, we pretty much knit on this show. I think the whole premise of it is to try and reimagine what knitting is, the things that you can create. If you put your mind to something, if you see something, you can you can knit it.

I think that's hopefully going to inspire people to not just think of knitting as a jumper or just a blanket. It's all of the things that you can create; the textures, the colours, the fibres but yeah, it's, I'm excited for people to see it.

What other sort of stereotypes do you think this new show is bound to clear up with viewers?

Sheila Greenwell:  Well, I think you've, you've got the main one there that throughout my entire life, when I've said  ‘I'm a hand knitter’ people have said, ‘oh, my granny knits’ but I mean, so does Tom! We want to break down those cliches and barriers.

But it's not just who does it. It's what it's possible to do as well, the range of challenges, and what we're actually asking these people to do is, well, it's as good as we could possibly make it.

Tom Daley:  The cast is amazing. You know, we have 10 knitters, eight weeks, and 16 challenges. We end up with one winner. We've got people from all backgrounds and genders. We've got people that are older, some that are younger, men, women. You know what? One person that I think is just brilliant, who has broken so many stereotypes, is that we have a builder who is a proper lads lad builder that loves to knit on a building site.

We’re filming in Scotland, so we've got two Scottish contestants. We have a couple of younger people, one just turned 18. They were the youngest they could possibly be! Then we've got some people in their early 20s, 30s, you know, some that are parents, some that are not.

It's really kind of amazing to see the depth of their talent and all of the things that they can create and the different styles that they have. Yeah, some are stronger in crochet compared to their knitting, some are stronger in knitting, some like doing colour work, some like doing lace work.

Everyone's personality comes out in their knitting, and I think you'll see that knitting is for everyone.

What’s the filming been like for you, Sheila and Diane?

Di Gilpin:  It's a really different space for us, because we tend to be quite quiet, working away in our studio doing lots of projects which a lot of people don't know about, with fashion companies, with Prince's foundation, you know, working on films. So yes, it's going to be strange. And normally, I never wear my own knitwear, so actually, wearing something that I've designed is going to be quite strange.

At the heart of it, as everybody has said, is that we love knit, we love crochet, we love wool. We love yarns. We love to see what people can invent and create and the journeys that they go on. The people in this series have grown in quite extraordinary ways.

And for me, when I see something made by one of them that is so perfect, so beautiful and perfect, it actually does reduce me to tears. It's fantastic.

I think also, you know, the depth and breadth of the design work they're asked to do for these incredible pieces. It's just stretching everybody. I know quite a few knitters have said to me, ‘For goodness' sake, how is anybody going to make something in 10 hours?’

Well, we know, in fashion, we are asked to do things. Or, for you know, somebody on film, we do have these challenges. We break them down, three to four people working on one piece, and we make it and achieve it. We know this is manageable, and actually, every challenge has been finished and has been fantastic.

Sheila Greenwell:  One of the things I particularly love is when they tell us from week to week that they are really, really trying hard to impress us. They’re bringing in new skills that they've only just learned. They're really upping their game as we're filming, which is very impressive and very brave.

What was their biggest challenge?

Di Gilpin:   We threw in a really difficult lace challenge. A lot of people don't get lace and don't knit lace, but it is one of the, you know, really important Scottish traditions, so that episode is stunning.

Tom Daley: There were tantrums. There were innuendos!

Yes, that was the most intense challenge so far. You imagine a knitting TV show, you're just watching people sit down for 10 hours, but no, this is like fast-paced, heart-racing. This is like knitting, like you've never seen it before.

It’s something that I think I'm really excited about people seeing for the first time, and I genuinely think it's going to inspire a new generation of knitters, crocheters.

I hope that, off the back of this, we can start getting it back into the school curriculum as well. I think it's incredibly important for kids to get involved, for mindfulness and to get away from screens, and, you know, a big push for slow fashion.

I think there's a real sense of achievement when people make something themselves. Every stitch is made with love. Every stitch is imperfect, perfect in its own way. I think that's what people are really embracing on this show so far.

Di Gilpin:  You know, getting children started early on is so important because it's just mindful, as Tom said, but it teaches them so many different skills. Maths, reading patterns, formulas, using their hands, and small motor skills as well.

If you could describe this show as a stitch pattern, what would it be and why?

Di Gilpin:  I think it would be a combination of Fair Isle with Cable with a bit of lace thrown in.

Tom Daley: Yeah, I was gonna say a patchwork with visible seams!

Sheila Greenwell: All the elements!

You all look very colourful today! Is this the dress code we can expect on the show?

Tom Daley: This is very subtle for me! I think the whole point of what I wear on the show is to show what you can do with knitwear. It’s not just a plain old jumper, you can do all kinds of different things, different textures, colours, lengths, shapes, sizes, everything.

How have you all found working together? Do you have individual roles within Game of Wool?

Sheila Greenwell:  Yes, quite defined.

Di Gilpin: He’s a brilliant presenter!

Tom Daley: I try my best! There were a couple of times throughout the show where I went around, and obviously, I spoke to everyone as they went.

There was one particular occasion where I saw someone making a huge mistake, and I had to not say anything, because I'm not meant to get involved! It was all really heartbreaking, but I've been really enjoying it.

I've been setting the challenge. I go around, chat to all of the knitters and then talk to Diane and Sheila. They're in there, ranking the knitters.

We go into the Stitchuation Room, where we deliberate on who should be passed off, who should be the big knitter of the week and who receives our like prestigious sheep baaa-dge every week.

We also have the haberdashery of dreams, which is the area where they can go and get all the materials. And then the yarn barn is where it all takes place.

We love all the puns!

Tom Daley: I am a dad joke extraordinaire. I don't know how much of it is actually going to make the air, because it is a pre-9 pm show, but there are lots of built-in innuendos in the knitting and crochet world, I feel…

Do you remember when you began knitting?

Sheila Greenwell:  I was taught when I was three. I come from an old town in the Scottish Borders, and I used to sit beside her and watch. She showed me how to do it. I could knit before I went to primary school!

Di Gilpin: I was the same, and an aunt visited every Tuesday. She wasn't a real aunt, she was a friend of my mum, so I called her Auntie Doris. She used to come on a Tuesday and have tea with us and sit down. She took me to my first yarn store when I was tiny, and then we were supported at school.

Tom Daley: I started just before lockdown, so I've been knitting for just five years now. I started because my coach told me I was too I was running around too much on the weekends. I needed to sit still, rest and recover so I could train better the next week.

Then it was my husband who suggested it. He works in film and TV, and he said lots of the actors he works with knit on knit on set. I got my yarn, got my needles, and logged onto the YouTube University and taught myself to knit through some tutorials online.

Di Gilpin: When we first met Tom, he'd flown over from LA. You arrived with your big bag of knitting, and literally within two minutes, we'd all got our knitting out.

Tom’s really inventive and creative. His knowledge has grown enormously. Having a presenter who knows knitting and crochet is fantastic.

Sheila Greenwell: It means that when we go into the Situation Room, otherwise known as the judge's den, we can have a really good chat.  

Tom Daley: My job is to make it knitting for dummies. My job is to clarify and simplify things for people who don't necessarily know knitting. There’s a lot of technical language, and I try to simplify it as much as possible for everyone watching.

I'm really excited because the crafting community is generally really supportive online. Hopefully, it will be a thing where lots of crafters get involved.

Di Gilpin: I'm really, really, really, really keen on people picking up their needles when they start watching and do a knit along. Sit on their sofas, yeah, wherever, and knit along with the program.

What advice do you have for anybody who watches the show and is inspired to pick up knitting but doesn’t know where to start?

Di Gilpin: I think they can actually find out if there's a local yarn store where they live, because a lot of people meet now in groups. In Edinburgh, there are about 40 knitting clubs for all ages, all everybody.

Sheila Greenwell: All abilities as well. In fact, people love it when someone new comes along. Just like we've seen on the show here, how supportive they all are with each other and how they help each other out. That happens in knit clubs as well.

It's completely addictive as well! Everybody is working on this; they're all knitting now. All the production team. We come into the kitchen, and they're all sitting there on their lunch breaks. They're all making things!

Tom Daley: They're making cardigans, bags, you name it. It's been really quite cool to see. I think that I would echo what I said, you would be so surprised how many people you already know that probably knit and don't necessarily talk about it.

The best way to learn to knit is for somebody to physically show you. I think, you know, you can watch YouTube tutorials, and that's all well and good, but having somebody sit with you, so at your local yarn store, yes, it's nice to be able to have somebody physically show you for the first time. Once you've got the basics, it won't take long to pick up.

I just taught somebody from STV just a second ago to knit in maybe six minutes. Once you get the basics of it, it's just a matter of, you know, figuring out how you're going to hold needles. That's the hard bit at the beginning, which is how to hold everything, and everybody has their own way of holding it.

Some people, I know Sheila, like to hold a knitting needle under her arm, and then we've got some people who like to hold needles above. Some have circular needles. Some do continental, some do English.

Sheila Greenwell: People should understand that whatever works for you is the good way to do it. There is no right or wrong way.

Tom, what made you want to present the show?

Tom Daley: I mean, it's a dream job, like I get to talk about knitting and crochet all day, which is basically what I do in my spare time anyway! It's nice to be able to do that and share this journey with people.

I just feel like it was the perfect way to bring knitting and crochet into the spotlight for people to, you know, be able to discover it. I think sometimes there have been so many stereotypes around who should be able to knit. And, you know, knitting is for older ladies, and actually, no, knitting is for everyone, and it's such an important skill.

Diane and Sheila were telling me all about how, you know, knitting started off as a predominantly male thing, and then it transitioned into being a more female thing throughout the war. Is that what you were saying?

Di Gilpin: Well, before then, I mean, Edwardian and Victorian era, there were big knitters making house coats to sit in around the fire. With the fisherman's knit, that has always been a woman's job, you know what they do for their husbands and sons going out on fishing boats.

The history of knitting is just so fascinating, very community-based and very family-based. It's also very practical, utilitarian, but also the art side of it.

Who approached you about Game of Wool, and what did you first think?

Di Gilpin: Three and a half years ago, the production company were at our studio actually thinking about making a different program, and they filmed us, and we have long chats about, you know, all the amazing projects we've done over the years, and came back to us and said ‘Can we repurpose this and do a knitting show?’

I had never watched The Sewing Bee or any Bake Offs or anything. But I thought, yay, absolutely fantastic. Let's get knitting and crochet out there, and so we started chatting about possible kinds of challenges.

Tom Daley: I mean, when I got approached for it, it was a no-brainer. But then there was a short list of presenters! I got the job, and I was super excited about it. It’s my first proper presenting gig, so I'm, yeah, I'm excited about it.

Are there any techniques you’ve picked up from the contestants? Or any ideas, projects and patterns?

Di Gilpin:  Yeah, we have seen some things. I can think of one straight away that I was like, really cool, really cool, this young man with this really cool approach to colour work. Yeah, we've seen everything we've seen in Intarsia, Fair Isle...

Sheila Greenwell: Well, we've asked them to do it! We’ve set a really wide range of challenges, both for group and individual work.

Tom Daley: I think it's just the little things, too, like little materials that people used. From synthetic fibres to natural fibres, to obviously your wool, but then people making their own yarn out of trash bin bags, bin bags out of wire. You name it, people make it. The engineering around the shaping and being able to, you know, figure out structure, it's, it's really quite fascinating.

Sheila Greenwell: The technical and design hoops that people are jumping through to impress us. It’s amazing.

What is the ratio of knitting to crochet in the show? They’re quite different techniques…

Di Gilpin:  They’re totally different, but they also worked together, as Tom said about his garment he's wearing.

Yes, there are specific knit challenges, there are specific crochet challenges, and then there are challenges where both can be used individually or together.

Tom Daley: The contestants have to be able to knit and crochet because it’s the Game of Wool!

Which challenges are you each looking forward to most or most excited about?

Tom Daley: We've already done six episodes, yeah, so we're already through some of the very interesting challenges. The group Challenge is a total surprise

Di Gilpin:  Sheila and I set a group challenge, Tom gives the challenge to them, and then Sheila and I leave. We have no idea who's done what, so we judge it blindly. This is finished. This is drama. This is, this is we don't know what's going on in the background.

Sheila Greenwell: They have to do this, literally, from start to finish. Tom comes in, hopefully every now and again, and says, 10 minutes to go.

Tom Daley: I think that's the challenge. There are things that you would never have seen done in knitting, unless you obviously are a knitter, even some of the things that they've been making, I'm like, I don't even know you could do that!

It’s those things, I think, that are going to inspire the next generation of knitting. Because some people don't want to make clothes, some people don't want to make a blanket, but all the other things that you can make around it.

How are you guys finding the elimination process? We imagine it gets tougher as you spend more time with everyone.

Di Gilpin:  When we're judging, we have very clear marking systems, through technical, through design, through everything. Everybody is marked for their group challenges and receives an individual mark for that.

Sheila and I go into the yarn barn. We talk to them about their ideas. They've had time to prepare for this project, and we can ask them lots of questions about how they're making it, what they're doing. Finally, we come back in and look at the finished pieces, and we go through all of those criteria between us -  a lot of technical stuff, which Sheila approaches.

 I tend to approach the design side, the concept construction, and how it's been made. We then put all those marks together, and so it's very carefully and thoughtfully made decisions.

Sheila Greenwell: It's a responsibility for us. It's a responsibility. We need to get it right.

Di Gilpin:  We really feel fairness is absolutely essential, and the marking has to be really clear. When we go into cast somebody off, I have welled up at this point, you know, because there are some amazing people there.

Sheila Greenwell: Particularly as we go through this, as we go through the series, and we get to know people so much better. It just gets harder and harder.

Tom Daley: It does. And I always have the horrible job of actually casting people off to do it. I feel so bad, especially when I have to rank them. Oh gosh, I'm not the one making these decisions!

It sounds like you had really helpful parameters within that to keep it also fair?

Tom Daley: It’s the same with any kind of creativity, and the same with diving; it's a subjective thing. They’re very clear at the top of the challenge, what they're looking for, design concept, the colours the the number of colours they have to use, the stitches that they have to use..

 Sheila Greenwell: We list things that we're looking for, and they have to fit that brief.

Thank you so much, we can’t wait to see it!

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Learn more about host Tom Daley

Want to know more about our favourite celebrity knitter? Take a look at 10 things you didn't know about Tom Daley.